Dense phase system is fine for milk powder conveying.

Nitrogen is not necessary. But you will require cool dry hygienic air supply.

Be very careful in pipe selection and conveying velocities milk powder with high fat content does block pipes very rapidly. ■

For these short distances vacuum dense phase is achievable depending on the hardware. But if you want to use lean phase 2” rubber hose with approx 100 m3/hr FAD should do it Giving pick up velocities of 12m/s. In rubber hoses there is less build up due to smearing build up shaken off due to vibrations and hose expansion /contraction. ■

Yes lean phase will defiantly affect the particle properties. Simple rule of thumb is “Higher the velocity higher the degradation”. You should be looking for venturi educator type vacuum systems. They are of the shelf modular units and can be easily adapted for a specific job and are very common in food industry. As far as my memory serves me they don’t cost a lot also. ■

 

Originally Posted by Mantoo

Yes lean phase will defiantly affect the particle properties. Simple rule of thumb is “Higher the velocity higher the degradation”. You should be looking for venturi educator type vacuum systems. They are of the shelf modular units and can be easily adapted for a specific job and are very common in food industry. As far as my memory serves me they don’t cost a lot also.

Dear Mantoo

for the milk powder, with capacity about 4t/h and LSR=10 for 40 meters pipelines(vertical 10m), if you have any experience about pressure drop with DN80 pipe? dilute pneumatic conveying .

Best Regards

■

Dear Chris,

If the pipe is empty (without any buildups inside) the pressure drop for conveying a massflow of 4t/h milk powder with approx. SLR=10 leads to a pressure drop of approx. 320 mbar.

Due to the "high" SLR, the necessary pressure in front of a venturi ejector should be approx 5 barg.

If you would a more detailed calculation and also an ejector don´t hesitate to contact ,e.

Best regards

Klaus Schneider

KSEngineering GmbH

Koeln - Germany ■

Originally Posted by kevinjcg

dear mantoo



for the milk powder, with capacity about 4t/h and lsr=10 for 40 meters pipelines(vertical 10m), if you have any experience about pressure drop with dn80 pipe? Dilute pneumatic conveying .

Best regards

=================================================================================

dear sir,

pressure drop will depend upon the conveying velocity and the type and number of bends you are using. You can calculate the pressure drop yourself using the equations given in my article "theory and design of dilute phase pneumatic conveying systems". If you wish, i will be glad to run these calculations for you.

Regards,

amrit agarwal

pneumatic conveying consulting ■

 

Originally Posted by Schneider

Dear Chris,

If the pipe is empty (without any buildups inside) the pressure drop for conveying a massflow of 4t/h milk powder with approx. SLR=10 leads to a pressure drop of approx. 320 mbar.

Due to the "high" SLR, the necessary pressure in front of a venturi ejector should be approx 5 barg.

If you would a more detailed calculation and also an ejector don´t hesitate to contact ,e.

Best regards

Klaus Schneider

KSEngineering GmbH

Koeln - Germany

Dear Klaus

thank you very much, what your said is dilute pressure conveying system pressure drop? but what you said "with venturi ejector should be approx 5 barg" if it is 5 psig ? yes. would you like to send me some information about ejector?

■

 

Originally Posted by Amrit Agarwal

=================================================================================

dear sir,

pressure drop will depend upon the conveying velocity and the type and number of bends you are using. You can calculate the pressure drop yourself using the equations given in my article "theory and design of dilute phase pneumatic conveying systems". If you wish, i will be glad to run these calculations for you.

Regards,

amrit agarwal

pneumatic conveying consulting

Dear Amrit

thanks for your reply, yes, I have your article about dilute conveying calculation, but I lack some factors to calculate pressure drop.

BR

■

 

Originally Posted by Schneider

Dear Chris,

If the pipe is empty (without any buildups inside) the pressure drop for conveying a massflow of 4t/h milk powder with approx. SLR=10 leads to a pressure drop of approx. 320 mbar.

Due to the "high" SLR, the necessary pressure in front of a venturi ejector should be approx 5 barg.

If you would a more detailed calculation and also an ejector don´t hesitate to contact ,e.

Best regards

Klaus Schneider

KSEngineering GmbH

Koeln - Germany

Dear Klaus

thanks for your reply, but if what your said if dilute pressure conveying pressure drop? and with "venturi ejector should be approx 5barg" . if changed to 5psig?

i appreciated if you can send me some information for ejector.

my email: jcgjcg168@163.com

Best Regards

■

Why don't you look at vacuum conveying?

You can get off the shelf hygienic stainless steel conveyor.

They are very low cost and are of modular design. Easy to clean also.

For such short distance you can even run it as vac dense phase depending

On the particle size of the milk powder, will also cause less degradation.

For positive pressure lean phase option I would go with easy clean rotary valve

With 350 mbar roots blower try to keep the loading ratio as high as possible

By running the RV on variable speed drive and run it as close to max blower pressure

It will reduce the build up. ■

 

Originally Posted by Mantoo

Why don't you look at vacuum conveying?

You can get off the shelf hygienic stainless steel conveyor.

They are very low cost and are of modular design. Easy to clean also.

For such short distance you can even run it as vac dense phase depending

On the particle size of the milk powder, will also cause less degradation.

For positive pressure lean phase option I would go with easy clean rotary valve

With 350 mbar roots blower try to keep the loading ratio as high as possible

By running the RV on variable speed drive and run it as close to max blower pressure

It will reduce the build up.

Dear Mantoo

thanks

yes, for milk powder, vacuum conveying is better compare with pressure conveying, but initial capital cost is higher compare with pressure conveying, and higher room is necessary for existing building.

in the future , I will try vacuum dense phase conveying to reduce particle degradation.

we design many by pass pressure conveying system to reduce particle degradation before, but not for vacuum dense phase conveying. I think it is interested.

I appreciated if you would like tell me your personal email? or would you like to send me your email address, my personal email: jcgjcg168@163.com

Best Regards

■

Dear Chris

It is always my plessure to help fellow bulkholics. If you need any help you can mgs me directly on this

Site. Or why not start a new thread as always you will be able to benifit from lot of experienced

Individuals here. ■

Originally Posted by Schneider

Dear Chris,

If the pipe is empty (without any buildups inside) the pressure drop for conveying a massflow of 4t/h milk powder with approx. SLR=10 leads to a pressure drop of approx. 320 mbar.

Due to the "high" SLR, the necessary pressure in front of a venturi ejector should be approx 5 barg.

If you would a more detailed calculation and also an ejector don´t hesitate to contact ,e.

Best regards

Klaus Schneider

KSEngineering GmbH

Koeln - Germany

Dear All,

My name is Richard Meadows. I work as a procurement assistant. I seek a reliable and neutral company or individual to partner with in the area of investment. I need your assistance to manage an investment fund in a profitable business in your region with good Annual Return on Investment (AROI). I know that this mail might come to you as a surprise because we neither know each other nor have ever met but please accept it with an open and positive mind.

Details of the investment and funding will be furnished to you when I receive your response which will also facilitate a face to face meeting with the investors.

Yours Sincerely,

Richard Meadows. ■

 

Originally Posted by Mantoo

Dear Chris

It is always my plessure to help fellow bulkholics. If you need any help you can mgs me directly on this

Site. Or why not start a new thread as always you will be able to benifit from lot of experienced

Individuals here.

Dear Mantoo

thanks for your reply, for milk powder conveying , how to define vacuum dense phase conveying? I think it depends the test. if flow model is plug conveying or sand dune flow, how much is SLR? also help to check if conveying distance is 50m with 15m vertical and 5 bends. if i can use vacuum dense phase conveying? and how much is the vacuum capacity?

thanks

Best Regards

■

 

Originally Posted by Mantoo

Dear Chris

It is always my plessure to help fellow bulkholics. If you need any help you can mgs me directly on this

Site. Or why not start a new thread as always you will be able to benifit from lot of experienced

Individuals here.

Dear Mantoo

thanks

i understood vacuum dense phase conveying is good for short distance conveying, if total length is 55-60m with 5 bends(r/d=8~10), including vertical pipe 15m, it is possible to achieve 4t/h with DN80 or DN100 pipe? how much is the SLR? because of parts safety, available vacuum is 0.4bar(absolute).

Best Regards

■

Originally Posted by kevinjcg

Dear Mantoo

thanks

i understood vacuum dense phase conveying is good for short distance conveying, if total length is 55-60m with 5 bends(r/d=8~10), including vertical pipe 15m, it is possible to achieve 4t/h with DN80 or DN100 pipe? how much is the SLR? because of parts safety, available vacuum is 0.4bar(absolute).

Best Regards

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

My understanding of milk powder is that it is compressive, and packs up under pressure. If this is true, in dense phase conveying it will result in plug flow, and will need some means such as injection of secondary air into the conveying line at various points along the conveying line to prevent developing excessive conveying pressures. This is true for both vacuum and pressure type dense phase.

For a new system, choice between vacuum or pressure depends upon the conveying system layout, conveying rate, and available conveying pressure. With proper design, the conveying velocity can be the same.

Regards,

Amrit Agarwal

Pneumatic Conveying Consulting

Email: polypcc@aol.com ■

 

Originally Posted by Amrit Agarwal

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

My understanding of milk powder is that it is compressive, and packs up under pressure. If this is true, in dense phase conveying it will result in plug flow, and will need some means such as injection of secondary air into the conveying line at various points along the conveying line to prevent developing excessive conveying pressures. This is true for both vacuum and pressure type dense phase.

For a new system, choice between vacuum or pressure depends upon the conveying system layout, conveying rate, and available conveying pressure. With proper design, the conveying velocity can be the same.

Regards,

Amrit Agarwal

Pneumatic Conveying Consulting

Email: polypcc@aol.com

Dear Amrit

thanks for your reply, i saw some conveying system for skim milk powder with dense phase(does not with by pass), it works well, but for long distance, I am still confirm the parameter.

Best Regards

■

Dear Chris

100nb pipe should be able to do 4 tons at this distance. But it will depend on the particle size distribution

and fat content of the milk powder. Make sure the feed hopper is bottom discharge and the powder is flood

feed into the pipe. ■